[Maru Kiba]

I have been noticing that the 2D games back then has a huger audience then the 3D versions of Sonic Games. Game critics, say if Sonic Team keeps making Sonic Games that end up being rushed and being not good at all they will crash down. Nintendo's Mario series is has been climbing gradually once when Super Mario came out. When Sonic came out on the GG first. (Sonic 1 came before Sonic the Hedgehog 1) They didn't get as big as they wanted. So they sent Sonic on the Genesis. Then the fans sprouted all over for Sonic games and Nintendo was worried Sonic would beat them. So Super Mario World came out for SNES and that was the biggest hit for Nintendo. IT still is #1 on the SNES.
So Sega made Sonic 2 and then Sonic 3 and Knuckles. To keep it going. Those games started the gradual decrease in fans but it was very little.
So then Nintendo made Super Mario 64 which gave Sonic Team the Idea to make a 3D Sonic game. Thus being Sonic Jam. But it didn't make it past SM64. When Dreamcast arrived. Sonic Team made Sonic Adventure. Which was the virtual rising action. then SA2 came out and then that started the Turning Point of Sonic Team. After so many games later Sonic 06' really did them badly.

So my statement is: Sonic 06' was a let down and now Sonic Team is nearing it's resolution. Now what kind of games Sonic Team can make to get it back on track, do u think would work? Think carefully

[Stefan]

I really don't know what to say. Except sonic came out on the genesis first. Not the game gear.

also that the line 'After so many games later Sonic 06' really did them badly. ' is a work of poetry.

[Groudon]

In addition, Sonic Jam is a compilation of 2D Sonic games.  The 3D world is just a bonus. (according to GerbilSoft)

[Rolken]

It's worth noting that Sonic Heroes sales were up there with the best of the 2D games.

[douglas]

It's worth noting that Sonic Heroes sales were up there with the best of the 2D games.

It's also worth noting that it was multiplatform (which gives in an edge over the Adventures and the originals), that gaming was much more mainstream when it came out, and that its development costs will have been much much higher than the Genesis titles.

On topic, what do I think that Sonic Team has to do to make a successful game?
1) Stop trying to be a AAA title.  You're not GTA4, live with it.
2) Stop with the godawful stories and voice acting.  If you must have them, decide what they're going to be and build the game around them rather than try and bludgeon them in (SRA as opposed to SSR).  Have a small writing team and stop doing it by committee.
3) No more new characters.  You have enough.
4) No Big.  Ever.
5) No furries getting off with humans.  Nobody other than PPA wants to see that.
6) Keep it simple.  Don't put in a million different moves and controls, we want to run, jump and smash shit.  Build a couple of gimmicks into each level to make them distinctive, and work them in in such a way that they don't just feel slapped on, they're actually a part of the flow.
7) MOST IMPORTANT: focus on making a game that's fun to play.  It can look like ass, have no sound or story and have Sonic mutilating kittens on the box art, and we'll love you for it as long as the core gameplay is there.

If they do all that, I really don't care if it's 2D or 3D or whatever, I'll enjoy it.

[EngiNerd]

And I just want to point out that Sonic 2 was THE highest selling GeneDrive game.  And Sonic 3 sold about as many copies as Sonic 1, so your theory about Sonic 1 selling the best and then immediately declining is false.

[Maru Kiba]

And I just want to point out that Sonic 2 was THE highest selling GeneDrive game.  And Sonic 3 sold about as many copies as Sonic 1, so your theory about Sonic 1 selling the best and then immediately declining is false.

I never actually said immediately. I stated that After Sonic 3 & Knuckles it started going down slowly Then 3D Blast. It didn't make as much buzz as StH1 or StH2. Sonic Jam for Sega Saturn. Don't know much about the game itself since I never played it and I don't have GEMS. It did make the top 10 on the Saturn.  It wasn't until Dreamcast era that brought Sonic Team back. SA and SA2 both made the top 10 on Dreamcast. Sonic Heroes was big at first since it was newer. But after awhile, it got almost monotonous playing it more than 50-100 hours. WHen I had the game, I played it alot at first, then after beating it on all 4 teams but didn't have all missions defeated. I got bored playing it.
I actually enjoyed playing both SA and SA2B alot more the Heroes. As to  end my point: It went from rising to turning to falling back up to rising then back to falling once again starting with Heroes, but SatSR actually was more steady than Heroes, so it saved ST for awhile at least. Shadow the Hedgehog is misunderstood, since it has shooting people. But grow up, GTA has perfectly shooting people!
Sonic 06' was rushed, and it didn't get as good as it should have been.

[douglas]

(3D Blast) did make the top 10 on the Saturn.

So it should have, there were bugger all Saturn games (NiGHTS and Panzer Dragoon were about it).  Also it was a Sega console, and Sonic was what really started shifting Sega consoles beforehand.  It's a fair bet a majority of Saturn owners were Sonic fans.

It wasn't until Dreamcast era that brought Sonic Team back. SA and SA2 both made the top 10 on Dreamcast.

See above comment.

Sonic Heroes was big at first since it was newer.

There were definitely gamers who wanted a decent 3D Sonic game who hadn't got a GC or a Dreamcast due to lack of games (I had a PS2 for that reason).

As to  end my point: It went from rising to turning to falling back up to rising then back to falling once again starting with Heroes, but SatSR actually was more steady than Heroes, so it saved ST for awhile at least.

Yeah, although there's an element of riding the Wii's monumental success and being in the right demographic for that console.  I'd bet it wouldn't have sold any had Galaxy been available at around the same time.

Shadow the Hedgehog is misunderstood, since it has shooting people. But grow up, GTA has perfectly shooting people!

And that's what I want when I buy a GTA game.  When I buy a Sonic game I want something different.</tired argument>
Also GTA has far, far superior gameplay mechanics.

Sonic 06' was rushed, and it didn't get as good as it should have been.

Sonic '06 had the wrong priorities from the start.  It was all pitched as a next-gen extravaganza, rather than as a solid platformer, and so the visuals and releasing close to console release dates were the key objectives.  Looking back, with the marketing effort, the brand, the presence in game stores and the backing of the console manufacturers it's astonishing just how badly Sonic '06 did - conventional industry wisdom (and I know whereof I speak on this) says selling games is about 90% positioning and marketing.  It's a testament to how awful the game was, really.

[P.P.A.]

When Sonic came out on the GG first. (Sonic 1 came before Sonic the Hedgehog 1) They didn't get as big as they wanted. So they sent Sonic on the Genesis.

Wrong. Sonic the Hedgehog was first released on the Genesis/Mega Drive, then ported to Master System and the latter version was then brought to Game Gear.

Then the fans sprouted all over for Sonic games and Nintendo was worried Sonic would beat them. So Super Mario World came out for SNES and that was the biggest hit for Nintendo. IT still is #1 on the SNES.

Super Mario World came out one year before Sonic the Hedgehog.

So then Nintendo made Super Mario 64 which gave Sonic Team the Idea to make a 3D Sonic game. Thus being Sonic Jam.

Sonic Jam was a collection of Sonic 1 - Knuckles with a bonus little 3D area where you could enter various buildings to look at/listen to bonus material.

But it didn't make it past SM64. When Dreamcast arrived. Sonic Team made Sonic Adventure. Which was the virtual rising action. then SA2 came out and then that started the Turning Point of Sonic Team. After so many games later Sonic 06' really did them badly.

What the fuck is a "virtual rising action"? And Sonic 06 is pro ok.

Actually inform yourself about what you're writing next time you make a thread.

So my statement is: Sonic 06' was a let down and now Sonic Team is nearing it's resolution. Now what kind of games Sonic Team can make to get it back on track, do u think would work? Think carefully

Sonic 06 was a step into the right direction, but its development was either horribly rushed or half-assed, what a waste of potential.
And what today's Sonic Team (since nobody of the old staff is actually left) needs to do? Cooperate with Artoon and let Naoto Oshima develop a Sonic game again, that man was the only one who really knew the true Sonic. 2D games are nice, if they're entirely 2D and not this lame 2.5D bs. To sum it up, either a 2D sequel to Sonic CD or a 3D game with similar level design to Sonic R (except not round courses of course), S1/SCD/Chaotix' surreal graphics style and momentum-based gameplay as opposed to "lol hold forward/right".

[P.P.A.]

Sonic Jam for Sega Saturn. Don't know much about the game itself since I never played it and I don't have GEMS.

It's not in the Gems Collection. Also the internet is your friend, especially The GHZ.

It wasn't until Dreamcast era that brought Sonic Team back.

NiGHTS into Dreams? Burning Rangers?

Sonic Heroes was big at first since it was newer. But after awhile, it got almost monotonous playing it more than 50-100 hours.

You're a masochist if you're playing it that long.

Shadow the Hedgehog is misunderstood, since it has shooting people.

Nobody cared about being able to shoot people in Shadow, people hate it because was a bad game with uninspired graphics, monotone level design, shitty story etc etc.

Sonic 06' was rushed, and it didn't get as good as it should have been.

Oh hey I actually agree.